Preserving Our Literary Heritage

Reparation and Empowerment

(Extract of an interview with David Hinds, Georgetown, Guyana, 2013. Professor Hinds lectures at Arizona State University and is a rights activist.)

PP: A few years ago, the whole year of 2011 was dedicated to the peoples of African descent, then a whole decade 2014-2024 was named in acknowledgment of the contribution of the people of African descent, why? Is it because we are now waking up to the realities – the effects of slavery? Is it because only now we are waking up to the humanity of enslaved peoples?

DH: Petamber, I think you have hit the nail on the head because since slavery ended in the 19th century, I think the world has been in denial about the tremendous negative impact slavery have had on African people, in particular, and a spinoff of that to rest of the world.
I think that … years later, we are coming to realize that something that penetrated the psyche of the world as slavery did could not be thrown off, swept under the carpet, that as a world we have to deal with it, that the impact was not only on the former slaves but also on the former slave masters and those who inherited and have to participate in a world that was shaped by it.

PP: Who is carrying ‘the fight’ now? We know from documented materials and fictionalized accounts of those who remonstrated and rebelled, some succeeding while others served as inspiration to go on – we are celebrating 250th anniversary of the 1763 Berbice Slave Rebellion, we’re poised to mark the 1823 Demerara Uprising and other related issues.
Those rebellions showed that the people knew they were being wronged and more importantly those displays of dissent showed the people’s humanity. They were fighting for themselves. Who is carrying the fight now?
DH: I think there is a new generation of Africans all over the world who after a lull of the last two or three decades are discovering some of the works done: Walter Rodney’s ‘How Europe Underdeveloped Africa’ – those who have the opportunity to go to university and others are reading that; Ivan Van Sertima’s ‘They Came Before Columbus’; they are reading ‘The Souls of Black Folk’ by W.E. B. Du Bois; they are reading Eric Williams’ ‘Capitalism and Slavery’; they are reading C. L. R. James’ ‘Black Jacobins’ – they are reading these classics that speak to the experience of Africans people but speaking particularly to the issue of resistance and gaining new perspectives on the world and on their own Africanness.
So there is that but I also think that the practical day to day experiences of African peoples all over the world whether it is in relationship to economics, whether it is in relationship to lack of education, whether it is in relationship against all forms of violence, they are beginning to make the connection between those and a larger post-slavery society that has inherited a whole bunch of these things from slavery itself. Slavery was about violence and the violence we experience today all over the world is really a spinoff of that.

PP: Interestingly, four of the five books you mentioned were written by West Indians – two by Guyanese, two by Trinidadians. And let’s not diminish the import of Norman Cameron’s ‘Evolution of the Negro’ which I have credited as a contributing factor leading to the first black man to be elected to the Presidency of America….

DH: Yes, yes, good point that!

PP: So the books you mentioned, the type of books we are reading can be labeled the heavyweights of this fight. The question remains – who is carrying the fight now? Answering this question we must be mindful of the movements such as Black Power, Rastafarian, Pan-African-ism and of leaders thereof like Marcus Garvey and others…

DH: Yes, the point is once people are subjugated, they throw up their own movements and their own leaders. Walter Rodney called it self-activity for self-emancipation. So all these mass movements arose out of the bowels of peoples’ resistance; as people resist, they created organizations, they creation civilization and so forth. And it was that that was responsible for the wave of movements in the 20th century.
Now as we turn into the 21th century, there was somewhat a lull in terms of African mass movements, part of it had to do with the success of the civil rights movements all over the world. African people have begun to move into echelons of the society from which they were formerly debarred….

PP: Let’s take a closer look at what you describe as ‘a lull’. Why the lull if we are now better placed in society to influence change?

DH: Because this was exactly what Du Bois meant when he talked about ‘the talented tenth’ when this talented tenth are well placed in society, they would be in a better position to serve the community. But what we are seeing is that the contemporary talented tenth, that once they began to do well, once they get onto Wall Street, once they get into the halls of power, they then become alienated, if you will, from the rest of the black community, they go into exile so they no longer respond and give back to that society. So there has been a disconnect between the black elite and the black masses…

PP: Rodney mentioned in ‘The groundings with my brothers’ that some of this talented tenth have sold their souls….

DH: Yes. But I think part of what we are seeing in this new movement, which I call a human rights movement, is that the black movements are grounded in the notion of human rights, part of it is sparked by frustration that some of us who have come out of exile …and walk the streets and pavements among the people and we see the tears of African people, we see the frustration of African people, we are then moved from a humanist standpoint to say wait that is where I came from and I have to do something to correct this condition. So you will see a small movement – the 1823 Movement, you will see the 1763 Movement – these are small steps being taken. So the answer to your question who is carrying the fight, I would say a kind of collation between what Clive Thomas called the poor and the powerless and those of us who take the time ever so often to look out of our windows and see what’s happening down there and say let’s go down there….

PP: … like what you do…

DH: Well, yes, in some ways I try to do that.

PP: And we must not forget Brother Eusi.

DH: He has been a tremendous example to persons like myself. And I would like to say in a direct answer to what you’re saying is what you are seeing now Kwayanite/Rodney movement taking roots again – Kwayana is about concreteness, something is happening here people are crying out, what do you do about it. Rodney is saying don’t wait for us to come and do something for you, do for yourself. That type of philosophy is what you see pushing the small steps.

PP: Is this philosophy of helping yourself being peddled?

DH: Yes.
Self-sufficiency and self-reliance has always been the bedrock of the ideology pushing Black Nationalism and Black Liberation. Like I said, we have moved away slightly from that but somehow we are beginning to gain some traction here and in the Caribbean and in the rest of the African Diaspora in saying to African people that governments are important, the larger institutions of society are important but it is only you in your collective effort can draw attention to your situation and thereby can begin to do something to repair it, once you begin to do something to repair it, then you begin to put pressure on those who in authority. They will say these people are not only crying out but they are also making steps, taking steps on their own like their ancestors who did not wait on the white abolitionist movements (they were black abolitionist movements too at the time of slavery, they did not wait for the abolitionists to come, in fact, the black abolitionist movements were joined by the while abolitionist movements.)
However, there is this notion that you cannot solve all the problems because a lot of your problems are structural and they need structure and policy approaches. But you can begin to make small contributions – you can begin to talk about discipline, you can begin to talk about education, you can do something about education, you can begin to talk how you should not spend more than you earn, you can begin to talk how to can make what you earn work for you and your family and your wider community. Those are some of the things you can begin to do, you don’t have to wait on somebody to come and tell you these things.

PP: Let’s go back to this lull you mentioned – can you pinpoint where and when this disconnect started? (to be continued)

Responses to this author telephone (592) 226-0065 or email: oraltradition2002@y

(By Petamber Persaud)

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